November 30, 2017 at 10:54 am
I came to databases and programming from enjoyment rather than a degree. I have a BA in History, which taught me to think critically, communicate with varied audiences, and all the other "soft skills" that get so much hype. I learned technology by doing and working with some great colleagues who challenged me.
Over the last 15 years I have worked with many good, and poor, programmers who have come from a variety of educational backgrounds, from computer science to theater. I have been in on the hiring process for many as well. A language or methodology can be taught, but I've found the core skills of a successful programmer are being able to apply knowledge learned and think outside of rote learning.
I would not go to school for a computer science degree these days, but I would go to school to broaden my horizons, interact with a variety of people, and learn, and practice, critical thinking skills.
November 30, 2017 at 12:10 pm
My IT career began in 1983 after I took a year-long course at one of those night computer programming schools in Paterson, NJ. I took courses in COBOL, RPGII, BASIC and Assembler during my last year teaching HS P.E. and Health. My first job was as a computer operator in an IBM environment. A year and a half after getting my computer programming certificate, I got my first programming job doing COBOL, JCL and CICS. This was way back in the 1980s.
Today, I'm 61 yo and the head of database operations for a NYC fintech company with 25 years experience in SQL Server. Never got a MS certificate of any kind except for SQL Server 6.5 Database Administration during an interview with a consulting company. Never got a master's. But I continually reinvented myself as technology evolved. I'm with a company that encourages employees to tackle projects that take you out of the comfort zone and force you to learn new technology. You got to have the positive attitude and willingness to keep learning in order to stay in a young man's game. I've been fortunate to stay motivated in that regard.
November 30, 2017 at 8:51 pm
You can absolutely be successful in the world of databases without a degree. The level of demand right now is crazy (at least where I live) and it's just going to keep growing. I've been screening/interviewing candidates for quite awhile and, quite frankly, if I met someone who could do fizzbuzz without a loop or tell me what OUTER APPLY does I wouldn't care if they finished kindergarten.
My degree is in Business and, though I could do just fine without my degree, what I learned in College was truly indispensable. My first SQL queries were on accounting databases where you need to understand credits/debits, depreciation, taxes, fixed assets, etc... I've since worked a in Banking, Finance and Mortgage which would be really hard without the Accounting (yuck), Finance (yum), and related college classes. If I could do it all over I would have studied math and Physics, perhaps a through my Masters degree. I'd even go back to school today for Math if I was not a dad. I would still want to be a Database Developer after college but you don't need college for that. SQL Server Central, a few user groups, an occasional SQL Saturday, a good Ben-Gan book and a laptop is more than enough IMO.
-- Itzik Ben-Gan 2001
December 1, 2017 at 7:22 am
If I were to go back to school, I'd probably peruse a MBA degree or MIS (Management of Information Systems) degree; something that would augment what I already know (database technology) or can be leveraged should I ever decide to change careers.
"Do not seek to follow in the footsteps of the wise. Instead, seek what they sought." - Matsuo Basho
December 1, 2017 at 7:34 am
Alan.B - Thursday, November 30, 2017 8:51 PMMy degree is in Business and, though I could do just fine without my degree, what I learned in College was truly indispensable. My first SQL queries were on accounting databases where you need to understand credits/debits, depreciation, taxes, fixed assets, etc... I've since worked a in Banking, Finance and Mortgage which would be really hard without the Accounting (yuck), Finance (yum), and related college classes. If I could do it all over I would have studied math and Physics, perhaps a through my Masters degree. I'd even go back to school today for Math if I was not a dad. I would still want to be a Database Developer after college but you don't need college for that. SQL Server Central, a few user groups, an occasional SQL Saturday, a good Ben-Gan book and a laptop is more than enough IMO.
There is a lot of benefit to a combined IT & 'other' education, such as business, marketing, law, medicine, engineering, biology, statistics etc. When my son was in school, he spent a couple of summers working with a major insurance company, managing new equipment deployments. He was already knowledgeable in computers, but learned a LOT about business issues including dealing with vendors, scheduling (and managing delays), following up on issues etc. Practical stuff you don't get exposed to in the ivory towers.
...
-- FORTRAN manual for Xerox Computers --
December 1, 2017 at 8:30 am
I think the educational system in the US is broken on so many levels. I do think we have the know-how and technology to fix it, but the battle is political. In the mean time, individuals and parents will just have to navigate the turmoil and dodge the costs and damages the current system brings.
December 1, 2017 at 8:37 am
chrisn-585491 - Friday, December 1, 2017 8:30 AMI think the educational system in the US is broken on so many levels. I do think we have the know-how and technology to fix it, but the battle is political. In the mean time, individuals and parents will just have to navigate the turmoil and dodge the costs and damages the current system brings.
I don't think its much better in the UK. I have however been quite impressed with MOOCs and Udemy - I am hoping that someone can make some dead hard certification that they can really gatekeep for quality where by they are not especially expensive to take but incredibly hard to pass and somehow these get international recognition as a measured sign of quality. The important thing is that they are open to all - you don't have to have your GNZY in Applied Dogma to get to the table gained by 2 years in a gilded tower.
In this regard I do like the SQL Server certifications - the exams are very reasonably priced.
December 1, 2017 at 11:20 am
I'll say that I think education is inherently broken in many ways, partly because as a large scale institution, it hasn't evolved as the world has changed. We aren't mostly farmers/ranchers that run small businesses. We aren't mostly factory workers. We aren't mostly people that will work in one or two large organizations (private or public) for most of our lives. We also aren't in need of memorizing lots of facts that we repeat back, nor do we need to perform many calculations by hand. Arguably, we don't even need to know how to write (I wouldn't argue this, but I rarely write anything).
We do need to know how to think, we need to adapt, and we need to learn to teach ourselves and make leaps (analytical, conceptual, etc.) from a set of data or circumstances. However, most of our educational institution (schools, teachers, admins, etc) didn't learn to teach that, nor did they grow up in that.
I don't know how to fix things, or change them. I just hope someone finds ways, and gets organizations (public and private) to adapt.
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