September 15, 2009 at 12:51 pm
I have worked for varying companies over the years, both good and bad. About 3 months ago I moved to another company to be closer to home.
As much as I love SQL Server and data warehousing I have found myself in a position where none of my colleagues understand about data warehousing - from the DBAs to the BAs through to the managers. When you have good specifications and understanding managers from a technical view point development is great and I really enjoy it.
Don't get me wrong I have tried to turn this into a positive and educate these people. It has started to work with some people like the DBAs, but the BAs and Managers aren't interested and don't take anything in. All the managers want to know is when a piece of work will be done.
I know from experience no job is perfect. Unfortunatly I am doing less and less development each day and instead trying to sort out fundamental problems, from the specifications, to ensuring documentation is being completed, making sure version control is being used, testing is being done correctly etc. My role was just to be 'another DBA' and code away in my own little silo as the others have done for the past 5 years. But as I want to do a good job and bring the team along with me I push back to management making recommendations on best practices.
They listen for a short time but then timescales are pushed and management are happy to have hacks done all over the place just to deliver work so they can put a tick in the box. I would rather deliver nothing than something which only will work for so long...it's a false economy.
As a team wo do not have a single manager for the DBAs and myself. Plus the managers we do have are not technical. I have never worked in a environment which has team members reporting to different managers. There is no direction or cohesion and I am finding myself arranging team meetings simply for the benefit of the team!
I am naturally highly motivated and passionate about what I do. But I am now beginning to question what I am doing there and asking myself what difference I can make whilst the current structure exists.
I am don't want to leave as the job fits my personal circumstances for the next couple of years but I am starting to wonder why coding good solutions when the work you do is constantly undermined by poor decisions by management. The developers are treated like expendable cannon fodder by the management which makes me want to move out of IT completely.
Was hoping you guys good maybe share your experiences or provide a different perspective on this?
Thanks All
September 15, 2009 at 12:57 pm
It sounds to me like staying will be convenient, but will probably result in stress-related health and personal issues.
How important is staying to you? Is it worth spending the next couple of years being frustrated, angry, stressed out, and compromising your ethics and sense of self-worth?
How bad is leaving? Is it merely inconvenient, or will it likely result in months without pay, loss of necessary health insurance benefits, having to swallow your pride and rely on friends/relatives for necessities?
Nobody can judge those things for you. Only you can make that decision.
- Gus "GSquared", RSVP, OODA, MAP, NMVP, FAQ, SAT, SQL, DNA, RNA, UOI, IOU, AM, PM, AD, BC, BCE, USA, UN, CF, ROFL, LOL, ETC
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"Nobody knows the age of the human race, but everyone agrees it's old enough to know better." - Anon
September 15, 2009 at 1:14 pm
I am reminded something a recruiter friend mentioned to me: You need a job to find a job.
Like Gus mentioned, the first thing you should do is come to a conclusion about your long-term prospects with this group. You seem to be leaning one way, but haven't quite committed to a course of action: first make a decision. Assuming you do decide this is not for you - then use it to find your better place.
It can be hard to operate without a lot of support, and it can weigh heavily on you if you let it. I've been in various situations that operate a lot like what you describe for some time, and not all situations are "salvageable". A few years back I gavve up on one such extreme scenario after trying for 3 years to fix it. One thing I can tell you: it takes time to change the minds of others. It can take time to show that your way is better than the chaos they have, more time to show that the differences are meaningful to the business, and yet more time to get the process to realign. But it CAN be done - the question is whether you want to be the one to make it happen.
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Your lack of planning does not constitute an emergency on my part...unless you're my manager...or a director and above...or a really loud-spoken end-user..All right - what was my emergency again?
September 15, 2009 at 1:27 pm
Thanks for your thoughts guys.
I know I don't have a long term future at this company but too be honest that was never the plan anyway. My plan soon after starting there was to remain for 2.5 to 3 years, get some training from them and in return try and upskill the existing team and attempt to break down the barriers to deliver a data warehouse - leaving them in a much better position then when I arrived.
Only now am I starting to see how big the 'education' challenge is! The last thing I want to do though is jump from the frying pan into the fire somewhere else. As I said on my original post few jobs are perfect.
September 15, 2009 at 1:31 pm
Only you can judge the cost/benefits/risk ratio on this one, since it's going to be subjective.
Would it possible for you to bring your concerns to a higher manager or executive without just turning the heat up even worse? (To continue the frying pan analogy.)
- Gus "GSquared", RSVP, OODA, MAP, NMVP, FAQ, SAT, SQL, DNA, RNA, UOI, IOU, AM, PM, AD, BC, BCE, USA, UN, CF, ROFL, LOL, ETC
Property of The Thread
"Nobody knows the age of the human race, but everyone agrees it's old enough to know better." - Anon
September 15, 2009 at 1:52 pm
If you look back the last three month:
What did change in your company that wouldn't have been changed if you hadn't brought attention to it?
That could give you some positive feedback that you already changed the company - even if just a little.
And don't forget the more important side of life:
What did change in your family/social life over the last three month?
Does your family/friends enjoy the time you gained since you're working closer or would your family/friends rather have a dad(?)/friend for a few hours less but a happy one?
September 15, 2009 at 3:39 pm
That's exactly what is keeping me where I am Lutz - the more important side of life.
Thanks all for you comments - I appreciate it
September 17, 2009 at 1:03 pm
I've been there and it's not a lot of fun. I think most of the times we'd just like to have our opinions heard and taken into consideration. To me when problems like this are acknowledged and alternative solutions are at least tried, then I can live with it. As long as there's an effort there from management and co-workers.
Unfortunately, it's the battle that wears me out long before the frustration does. Eventually, I stop fighting and conform for my own sanity and health, but that doesn't really help much either.
So, I've got two things for ya:
1) Serenity Prayer 🙂
2) I know this won't help much, but it made me think of a joke that comes to mind when I find myself in a situation like this: http://www.jokes.com/funny/business/monkey-business
September 17, 2009 at 1:43 pm
Some good advice given, and sorry you're in a tough situation.
My advice would be this: change your attitude while you're there. Don't try to be a perfectionist, don't try to make things perfect. Do your best, give you input, keep doing what you're doing, but deliver what people want. You can preach to them, and try to bring them along, but you can't force them. If they don't want to, just let it go. Don't be petty, don't "I told you so", but gently show them where things could be better, or how you'd like to avoid a problem next time.
It's harder than it looks, but if you turn your view on the situation, you'll feel better. Remember it's just a job. And you are paid to do what management wants, not what you want.
Put your energy into some other area. Volunteer your efforts online, blog, write, speak, try to educate others and help those that want to be helped. It's almost the attitude of a preacher (rabbi, imam, etc.). You try to bring others to your view of thinking, but if they don't want to receive the message, you accept that.
and keep delivering it.
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September 18, 2009 at 8:24 am
aaa-322853 , first hang in there. I was once in a similar situation. Initially I tried to push back and fight them but then I was to by the recruiter that the mgmt. staff said, "he's a nice guy and does great work but he's very difficult to deal with". It was probably the hardest thing I've ever had to overcome in my career.
My plan of action over the next couple of months, I actually had to "play down" to the manager(s) and just pump the work out. Each time I pumped out the work I included a summary of what was done and how long and then also included a proposal what I would recommend to do next (i.e. best practices, etc.) and how long it would take and short/long term benefits to the team and users. I also added in potential cost savings if possible to estimate. I didn't force feed the info I just provided it and walked away. Even though it was incredibly tempting to start on the next step I coded away like the managers asked.
The first 4 "proposals" went unnoticed. One day a manager actually asked me, "we have a new project and we need you to help provide 2 estimates. One being how long and how much to get it done, and another for how long, how much, and additional benefits to get it done right." I'm not sure how it happened but it almost clicked in their heads that a quick project was always the cheapest project.
To say that I'm in a perfect world right now would be false. I still don't always get to do the project the right way (it's around 50%) but at least I get the satisfaction of letting my mgmt. staff know how I feel without being pushy or difficult. Really it is their decision on how I spend my day so if they think it's better to produce a product with a short development cycle with continual maintenance opposed to a long development cycle that hums without tweaks.
It really is their call, all you and I can do is provide them enough information to try to swing their opinion. Mostly the almighty dollar works the best if you could estimate the cost saving down the line.
Remember your closer to home and what is truely important in life. Don't try to change the workplace overnight, change your outlook on it and slowly try to turn the ship.
September 18, 2009 at 9:10 am
I think that's a good way of going about it tmacs.
Another option is to find something that might be done better and do it yourself on your local instance (if you have one) or maybe even at home and then show it to others as a "proof of concept". Something that they can see and touch, without having to take your word for it. I know that for larger projects this becomes less feasible, but for some of the smaller things to start out with, it can possibly win some people over.
Either way though, I make sure that I do it on my own time by staying late or working from home.
September 18, 2009 at 10:01 am
Thanks all, some good advice.
It's funny that I have found myself going through these different phases you all mention. Let me give you more information on the background which brings me to this point.
Firstly I was making my comments known to management, changes in the structure of the teams, enhancing the architecture etc. All to get us in a better place you understand. I soon got the opinion management thought I was coming up with issues to stop doing work when really I was attempting to highlight potential solutions.
So I gave up on that approach, made my proposals and sat tight. Any work I had to do I made sure was done to the highest standard the current archicture allowed. In addition I made recommendations on each part of work I was involved with and included this as part the documentation.
I gradually positioned myself as more of an DW/BI advisor to the business. Providing expertise and best practice advice to ongoing projects when requested.
Since then I some of my initial proposals have been taken on board and I've been given some resource to build a better solution, which does however have to be built upon some of the existing archicture (which isn't great) better data sources are available but politics gets in the way of moving away from the existing system we have to use. This shows the business has listened and is putting some effort into making things better which is promising.
So this is where I am now. The existing architecture is acting as a bit of stranglehold on what were trying to put in place and educating the business is a huge task. It feels like trying to swim upstream a lot of the time. I am committed to deliver a solution which is the best possible - I would rather deliver something which the business can use rather than something which only half works. So the biggest challenge is getting acknowledgement from management that data warehousing is more complex than a typical OLTP system and ownership of certain areas needs to be taken upon by areas of the business. In light of all of these issues I really hope that I can make this work and deliver something we can be proud of.
September 18, 2009 at 10:07 am
Sounds like you're moving in a good direction. Good luck, and remember that you should feel good you're doing the best you can with what you have. Don't let it eat you up that there are better solutions out there.
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May 9, 2010 at 8:52 am
Since the job fits your personal situation I think that you should focus on keeping your job as part of the big picture until you are sure that you have a better career option or a much better job prospect.
From experience, i would say that you should continue doing what you are doing now even though it is not what you want because you are distinguishing yourself and setting yourself apart from the rest of the DBA team.
There are several positives to the job:
1. Your management actually listens to and acts on your recommendations even though it is for a short while
2. Your team members are open to your advice and your mentoring which is a big plus ... because they don't have to
Sooner or later, the rash of poor decisions being made by management is going to catch up with them and they will realize that it is time to reward you by giving you a more senior role or by listening to your recommendations or by changing their policies.
When that happens, you will magically seem to have found the perfect job or to be in the right place at the right time. All around in corporate america, people are losing their jobs and this is the time to make your career work and not even to think of leaving or to think that something out there is easier or better!
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